Point A - When did the information become declasified is important, but gets the usual, "can't talk about on-going legal matters" bullshit answer. You will notice, that most people believe it was declasified ten days after it was leaked:
Q I understand the reason why you thought it needed to be declassified, because of the debate at the time. The question was, when was it declassified. And you were asked that day, when -- the question was, "When was it actually declassified?" And you said, "It was officially declassified today."Point B - Was the information declasified to benefit the public, or for purely political reasons - as in to avoid indictment? Moreover, it will probably become a sticking point as to whether it was declasified by the President before or at the same time it was released to the public?
If it had been officially declassified on July 18, 2003, then 10 days before, when the information was given out, it was still classified at the time.
MR. McCLELLAN: Again, you're going back to an assertion that is made in a filing related to an ongoing legal proceeding when you talk about the second part of your question. There is no way for me to separate that question and talk about this issue without discussing an ongoing legal proceeding. And I can't do that. We have a policy that's been established, and I'm obligated to adhere to that policy.
Q But answer the question, it's a factual question.
MR. McCLELLAN: Yes, but you can't separate that question from the legal proceeding --
Q Was it declassified that day --
MR. McCLELLAN: -- because of one of the assertions that was made in the filing.
Well, you can go back and look at comments that were made at that time. That was when it was --
Q Those were your comments.
MR. McCLELLAN: -- that was when it was publicly released at the time. I haven't looked back at exactly what was said at that time.
Q Well, let's be really clear about this. It says right here on July 18th, "When was it actually declassified?" Mr. McClellan, answer, "It was officially declassified today." Is that correct?
MR. McCLELLAN: Again, you're asking me to get into the timing. I'm not backing away from anything that was said previously -- that's when the document was released, so that's when it officially --
Q They don't say "released." They say "declassify."
MR. McCLELLAN: I know, Jim. Let me tell you. That's when it was officially released. So I think that's what I was referring to at the time. I'd have to go back and look at the specific comments, but I'm not changing anything that was said previously, so let me make that clear.
Q But if you were --
MR. McCLELLAN: Now, secondly, the question you're going to, again, relates to the timing of when certain information was declassified --
Q I'm not going to that question --
MR. McCLELLAN: Well, but there's no way you can separate that question out from the ongoing legal proceeding --
Q Scott, you are very careful with your words here. I think if you wanted to say "released," you would have said "released." You said, "declassified."
MR. McCLELLAN: Okay.Point C - Is the President pissed at himself for leaking such information, classified or not? Doubt it - he doesn't apologize for things like this, now does he?
Q Well, what does that tell --
MR. McCLELLAN: That's when the information was released publicly.
Q Scott, did you not know --
MR. McCLELLAN: But there was --
Q That's not what --
MR. McCLELLAN: Now, for the National Intelligence Estimate, Jim, it did go through a declassification process; you are correct. And the information was carefully looked at by the intelligence community before the portions of the National Intelligence Estimate were made available to the public --
Q But, Scott, you said, "declassified." If it's declassified on that day, it wasn't declassified before. And you're saying you're sticking to -- you're not taking back anything you said before, and what you said that day is it was officially declassified.
MR. McCLELLAN: I'd be glad to take a look at exactly what I said, and I'll do that.
Q You didn't say -- I mean, we've got that here --
MR. McCLELLAN: I can't do that here in this room right now, but I'll be glad to take a look at it --
Q Then why are you saying you're not backing up from anything if you --
MR. McCLELLAN: Well, what I'm saying is that -- I think what I was referring to is the fact that that was when it was made available to the public. So all that information is officially declassified at that point.
Q Then why are you saying you won't back off anything you said before if, in fact, we have transcripts here where you say that's when it was officially declassified? Are you still saying that's when it was officially declassified?
MR. McCLELLAN: That's when it was made available to the public. So it's officially --
Q When was it officially declassified?
MR. McCLELLAN: -- so it's officially declassified at that point. I think we're talking past each other a little bit. I'll have to go back and look at the specific transcript -- and I'll be glad to do that -- and we can talk about it further later.
Q Okay. When was it officially declassified?
MR. McCLELLAN: Again, in terms of the timing of when information may have been declassified, that gets into a question relating to the legal proceeding in a filing that was made by Mr. Fitzgerald earlier this week.
Q What were you referring to on July 18th, then? Was that the official release, or official declassification?
MR. McCLELLAN: Well, that's what I'll have to check. I'll have to go back and look. But my sense is, and my recollection is -- while we're sitting here talking about it is -- I was referring to the fact that was when it was officially declassified for the public.
Q Scott --
Q Can I just -- one more here. In terms of releasing information and leaks, you know the President has been highly critical of people who leak --Point D - Was the reason that they declasified the material purely political? If not, what benefit was it for the public to see this information? More importantly, what damage was done by a President who released/declasified information that contained the identity of a CIA covert op?
MR. McCLELLAN: Absolutely.
Q -- not just classified material. He has said in the fall of 2003, "I've constantly expressed my displeasure with leaks." Now, whether the argument from the administration is he declassified this, so it wasn't classified information -- I know you're not going the get to the legal issues here -- but he has criticized people who leak, not just classified information. And there were clearly leaks coming out of this White House --
MR. McCLELLAN: What was the context of my comments -- about leaking of classified information, I believe.
Q He was asked about leaking classified information, but the President said, "I've constantly expressed my displeasure with leaks." Not just classified information. He says "particularly leaks."
MR. McCLELLAN: The President believes the leaking of classified information is a very serious matter. And I think that's why it's important to draw a distinction here. Declassifying information and providing it to the public, when it is in the public interest, is one thing. But leaking classified information that could compromise our national security is something that is very serious. And there is a distinction.
Now, there are Democrats out there that fail to recognize that distinction, or refuse to recognize that distinction. They are simply engaging in crass politics. Let's make clear what the distinction is.
Q He said, "displeasure with leaks," not just classified leaks, though, Scott.
Q Scott, can I follow on that for a second. Because in December of 2003, to follow on this, he says, "If there's a leak out of the administration, I want to know who it is." Now, is there a question -- we're not talking about legality here -- while he's saying that, according to the court filing -- which I know you can't get into the specifics of -- but as he's saying it, he certainly is aware who would have allowed the information to be disseminated. So, at best, isn't the statement "If there's a leak out of the administration, I want to know who it is" -- at best, isn't that just inconsistent, if not misleading?
MR. McCLELLAN: Absolutely not. That's referring to the leaking of classified information.
Q Only the leaking of classified information. He doesn't --
MR. McCLELLAN: I think that in the context of what that question was responding to --
Q ?So what about if it's a political? And if it's in political -- if there's a political purpose to it, then it's finePoint E - Could some one just ask Mr. McClellan what that greater public interest was? I am having a diffuclt time figuring that out other than the obvious need for the W, Rove and Co to make their tarnished heels look clean when they indeed trod throug the mud.
MR. McCLELLAN: If it's in the public interest, it's another matter. And the National Intelligence Estimate was declassified because it was in the public interest to provide portions of that National Intelligence Estimate to the American people. As I said, there were people that were out there making irresponsible accusations that intelligence was manipulated or that intelligence was misused. There has been no evidence to back that up whatsoever. And if you look at the National Intelligence Estimate, Jim -- you weren't here at the time, but some others in this room were -- it shows the collective judgment of the intelligence community.Point F- Did Scotty knowing mislead the American people? of course, he isn't going to answer this one:
And then you go back and look at the bipartisan Robb-Silberman commission, and they said there is no evidence of political pressure on the intelligence analysts. You go back and look at the Butler report. The Butler report said that there was no evidence of deliberate distortion. You go back and look at the Senate Intelligence Committee report, they say they did not find any evidence that administration officials attempted to coerce, influence or pressure analysts to change their judgments.
So this was part of the debate that was going on at that time in the public. And so it was in the public interest that information be declassified.
Q I understand that. My only question is --
MR. McCLELLAN: And this information, too -- and another distinction. This was pre-war intelligence we're talking about. So it was historical context that was being provided, not information that could compromise our nation's security.
Q My only question is looking ahead, when he then says, "I want to know who the leaker" was -- doesn't he know, since he authorized the disclosure of the information?
MR. McCLELLAN: Actually, go back and look at the filing that was made by Mr. Fitzgerald, because Mr. Fitzgerald talks about that very issue in his filing and contradicts what you're suggesting.
Q I'm not suggesting -- this has nothing to do with Valerie Plame, nothing to do with it.
MR. McCLELLAN: I think that's what the question was about.
Q My question is, though, at the same time -- at the same time he's -- even if there's nothing to do with Plame, there is some disclosure about NIE information.
MR. McCLELLAN: Let's draw the distinction here, again. There is an important distinction that people need to make when they are looking back at this issue. I just laid out what that distinction is. You're talking about information that was declassified and provided to the American people because it was in the public interest that they have that information so they could see what the facts were. And the facts were that this was the collective judgment of the intelligence community.
Now, the intelligence was wrong, and that's why we put in place a bipartisan commission, independent commission to go and look at the intelligence, and they made recommendations about how we could improve our intelligence-gathering. And we have implemented many reforms to make sure we get the best possible intelligence.
Q Scott, I've got a couple of things here. First, did you have any personal knowledge on July 18th -- when you answered the question that started off this round of questions -- did you have any personal knowledge of discussions between the President and the Vice President about declassifying portions of the NIE?Point G - Like I said, there was clearly a political win for the W, Rove and Co to declassify this information.
MR. McCLELLAN: That's a question that gets into talking about an ongoing legal proceeding, and I just can't do that because the policy of this White House is that we are not going to comment on it while it's ongoing. So I'm adhering to that policy, and I would hope that you could appreciate that.
Q You've at times at this podium told us that you had had assurances from people and that's caused you a lot of trouble, from this podium. Are you saying that that statement was true at the time that you knew it?
MR. McCLELLAN: Again, in terms of -- which statement are you referring to?
Q That on July 18th it was officially declassified.
MR. McCLELLAN: Well, again, that question was asked at the beginning and I think what I was referring to is this is when it's now being made available to the public, so it's officially declassified at that point.
Q That's not what you said, though, we know that --
MR. McCLELLAN: I'll have to take a look at it. No, I think that's what I was referring to.
Q There is a distinction, though --
MR. McCLELLAN: Deb, hold on. I'll be glad to take a look at it, and we can talk about it. I'm around all day.
Q We're trying to give you an opportunity here, and --
MR. McCLELLAN: I haven't gone back and looked at every single word that was said at the time. But, again, based on what Deb just said, my recollection is that I was referring to the fact that, yes, it's officially declassified today.
Q All right, let's talk about the politics of this.
MR. McCLELLAN: But that doesn't get into the issue of when everything was declassified.
Q The purpose of releasing portions of this clearly had a political implication for the administration. There is a debate going on, and you wanted to counter that debate. And, yet, you're criticizing Democrats, saying that they are engaging in crass politics for saying that they're -- that this was leaking. How do you not see that there was a --Point H - Of course, you see above, that Scotty tries to switch the subject and focus of attention on the leaking of illegal spying program. Aren't you at this point thinking what you wouldn't give for a plain old fashioned sex-scandal where impeachment is such a simple matter. Well, now wait, Helen weighs in on this using her usual cast iron fry pan to smack Scotty over the head with some straight up questions that again get no answer:
MR. McCLELLAN: For the reasons I stated. That's a very good question. Let's talk about the distinction. There is a difference between leaking classified information that could compromise sources and methods, which could be harmful to our nation's security. The terrorist surveillance program is a prime example. There was an unauthorized disclosure of this vital program that is helping to prevent attacks and save American lives. This is a program that is aimed at intercepting international communications involving known al Qaeda members or suspected al Qaeda affiliates. And it is vital to our nation's interest.
General Hayden, the number-two man in our intelligence community, said its disclosure is harmful to our nation's security. So there is a clear distinction here. Democrats refuse to recognize that distinction. That is engaging in crass politics.
On the issue of the National Intelligence Estimate, that is something that was in the public interest that it be disclosed because there is a lot of debate going on. And we will vigorously set the record straight when people are putting out misinformation or trying to suggest things that simply are not true.
Point I - Is the leaking of top-secret information what the President should be about?
Helen, go ahead.
Q Did the President know that Joe Wilson was married to a CIA agent before Novak revealed it?
MR. McCLELLAN: Again, this goes to -- go back and look at previous comments, but this goes to an ongoing legal proceeding, and I would encourage you --
Q Did he know? It's a simple question.
MR. McCLELLAN: -- I would encourage you to go and look at the filing that was made just the other night, because Mr. Fitzgerald touches on that subject in the filing.
Q You mean the President did not know?
MR. McCLELLAN: Helen, I can't get into discussing an ongoing legal proceeding, and that's a question relating to the ongoing legal proceeding.
Q I think it's a very simple, important question.
MR. McCLELLAN: Matt, did you have something?
Point J - Who has a credibility problem, the Republicans in charge, or the Democrats on the attack?
Q Yes, your refusal to comment on this on the grounds of it being an ongoing legal proceeding --
MR. McCLELLAN: Let me -- let me -- hang on, hang on --
Q -- that leads to the conclusion that --
MR. McCLELLAN: Hang on.
Q All right.
MR. McCLELLAN: Hang on. Let me just say why and remind people why. There is an ongoing legal proceeding underway that is headed toward trial. We want to see a fair trial. We want to see due process. We don't want to do anything that could compromise this ongoing legal proceeding or compromise or jeopardize the trial. And that has been our policy with other matters, as well. And so this has been a policy that has been well established for a long time.
Now, to your question.
Q This inevitably leads to the conclusion that you are not disputing the allegation that the President was involved in the leaking -- or authorized the leaking of classified information. Are you satisfied with that? And is that really in the interests of the American people?
MR. McCLELLAN: I'm not getting into confirming or denying things, because I'm not commenting at all on matters relating to an ongoing legal proceeding.
Q Scott, just a --
MR. McCLELLAN: Let me come back to you. Elaine, go ahead.
Q Scott, let me ask you about the issue of credibility. Isn't the fact that you're up here having to vigorously defend and make the distinction between what some people see as leaking and what you are saying, from what I understand, is the sharing of information to provide historical context -- isn't that illustrative of the fact that the President's credibility has been damaged by it?Point K - If when it was declasified and released to the public were one and the same points in time, indeed, leak happened ten days before it was done so. This is rather spurious behavior on the part of the W, Rove and co. Indeed, one wonders if there a repetative pattern of behavior where the W, Rove and Co intentionally misleads the American people?
MR. McCLELLAN: The Democrats have a credibility problem when they try to suggest that we were manipulating intelligence, or that this is about something other than what I just said. That's crass politics. And they're the ones who have an issue when it comes to what you bring up.
Q I want to see if I can sort out what you described earlier as sort of "talking past" each other earlier. There's a process for declassification, and the President has declassification authority.Point L - Again, we see how Scotty is going to split hairs and deflect this situation toward the illegal spying program.
MR. McCLELLAN: That's correct.
Q When the President determines that classified information can be made public without jeopardizing sources and methods, that it's an appropriate thing to do, is that -- can that supplant the declassification process? Is that, in effect, an immediate act? Is it de facto declassified by that determination --
MR. McCLELLAN: The President can declassify information if he chooses.
Q So if a declassification --
MR. McCLELLAN: It's inherent in our Constitution. He is the head of the executive branch.
Q Is it possible, then, for a declassification process to be underway, or perhaps not yet even started, but perhaps in the middle of it, the President can say, this is declassified and -- or this is something that is worthy of the American people seeing, and they can happen on separate tracks?
MR. McCLELLAN: I want to be careful here, because that is touching on something that is brought up in the legal proceedings. So --
Q Well, it's a question more about administrative policy and how the White House would handle it.
MR. McCLELLAN: -- but the President is authorized to declassify information as he chooses.
Q Right, so just one other question, if I can. You've already taken a couple of shots at Democrats, but the Minority Leader this morning has gone to the Senate floor and demanded a whole series of questions to be answered. At one point, he says that only the President can answer the question as to whether or not the buck stops in the Oval Office or the leaks start, and has suggested that what he is now seeing -- Harry Reid, the Minority Leader -- in his opinion, it speaks to a pattern of misleading America by the Bush White House. It raises somber and troubling questions about the Bush administration's candor with Congress and the American people.
This does seem to be yet another example of the Democrat's ability to criticize the President for not coming clean on all of this. How would --
MR. McCLELLAN: That is exactly --
Q Hold on.
MR. McCLELLAN: Okay, go ahead.
Q How would you explain to the nation the President's assertion that anybody who leaks information would be prosecuted, when they are now -- the Democrats now see that the President --Point M - Crass policits. I call bullshit here. I want some answers - why did they declassify information that revealed a CIA covert ops name to the press? Becuase it was politically important for them to do so. Talk about crass politics - and cold hearted, cold blooded war mongering are also terms that fly through my brain right about now:
MR. McCLELLAN: Leaking classified information.
MR. McCLELLAN: There's a distinction here. That is the kind of crass politics that I am referring to. Democrat leaders, like the one you brought up, are refusing to acknowledge an important distinction here. First of all, the national intelligence information was declassified information that was provided to the American people.
Now the other issue I brought up was the issue of the terrorist surveillance program. You bet the President has spoken out about its unauthorized disclosure, because what its disclosure has done is shown al Qaeda, our enemy, the play book. This is an enemy that watches us very closely. This is an enemy that adapts and adjusts when they learn information about our tactics. And it's important -- it's important, as we carry out this war on terrorism, that we don't do anything that could compromise our nation's security.
The terrorist surveillance program has been a vital tool that has helped to save American lives. And it's one tool, in an overall arsenal of tools, that we are using to take the fight to the enemy and stop attacks from happening on American soil.
Q But I just want to make sure I understand. In effect, your answer to the Harry Reid criticism is that the President has the authority to declassify. Therefore, the discussion of leak is inappropriate.
MR. McCLELLAN: My response to what he said is that that's just crass politics, because he is not acknowledging an important distinction. And the distinction is that, one, the information that he was referring to was declassified. And the other information he's trying to twist and put into that is a separate matter. These are two separate issues.
Point N - How does the president feel about this whole situation? One could only hazard a quess from Scotty's answer:
Q Two questions. One, as far as U.S.-India --
MR. McCLELLAN: Let me stay on this topic, and I'll come back. Go ahead.
Q You all talk about the court filing -- you've said that. But you seem to want to convey the idea that if what happened in the court filing happened, then it's okay, because it wasn't classified at the time --
MR. McCLELLAN: I'm not conveying any ideas about the court filing. What I'm talking about is the facts, at the time, and trying to put in context for people in this room and people that are listening, the time period and what was going on during that time period. But the National Intelligence Estimate was declassified in part because there was a lot of debate going on, and there was a lot of misinformation out there. It was important for the American people to have that information.
Q You seem to be trying to come up with a definition of the word "leak", which is that if it's not classified, and it's not endangering national security by revealing it, then therefore it's not a leak. Is that a --
MR. McCLELLAN: No, that's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is that there is a difference between providing declassified information to the public when it's in the public interest, and leaking classified information that involves sensitive national intelligence regarding our security.
Go ahead, Martha.Point N - one lump or two? How many should we give the W, Rove and Co for shirking their ethical responsiblity, not to mention placing themselves above the law?
Q Can I just go back to this original statement that the President said about, "I constantly express my displeasure with leaks, particularly leaks of classified information" -- leaving the impression he doesn't like any leaks. Can you give us an idea how the President feels about leaking information, since if this information --
MR. McCLELLAN: Well, I think we have to draw distinctions here, and what specifically you're referring to. I mean, if people are going out there talking about a potential policy decision-making process that is still in development and that the President hasn't come to a decision on, then that's not helpful information, and of course we'd look down on something like that.
Q But otherwise, if it's helpful to you and it's declassified, leaks are okay?
MR. McCLELLAN: No, if it's in the public interest.
Q Leaks are okay?
MR. McCLELLAN: No, I didn't say that. What I'm saying is that the issue here is the National Intelligence Estimate --
Q No, I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about leaks.
MR. McCLELLAN: -- and the declassifying of the National Intelligence Estimate.
Q I'm talking about a statement the President made in the fall of 2003.
MR. McCLELLAN: I'm not going to try to draw a broad conclusion, or make a broad statement. If you've got specific instances you want to refer to --
Q No, you seem to be saying it's bad to leak classified information that will hurt the country --
MR. McCLELLAN: Let me give you a specific instance --
Q -- but it's not bad to leak declassified.
MR. McCLELLAN: A specific instance is the leaking of classified information that could harm sources and methods, or put them at risk, or harm our nation's security. One is the terrorist surveillance program.
Q Understood, but that's not the issue here.
MR. McCLELLAN: Sure it is part of the issue, because that's --
Q It's part of the issue, but not the part of the issue I'm trying to get to.
MR. McCLELLAN: -- that's exactly what the President is referring to when he's talking about leaking of classified information. That's exactly the kind of information he's talking about.
Q I know he is, but what I'm saying is the President expressed displeasure about leaks, not just classified leaks, but displeasure --
MR. McCLELLAN: Sure, he's talked about that in the past.
Q So he has displeasure about leaks, even of declassified material?
MR. McCLELLAN: Well, again, you have to look at what specific instance are you talking about.
Q Well, you won't talk about the specific instance we want to talk about --
MR. McCLELLAN: No, I just gave you an example.
Q -- so, in general --
MR. McCLELLAN: I just gave you an example.
Q -- if you leak something, he has no problems as long as it's not classified?
MR. McCLELLAN: That's not what I said, Martha. What I said is what I said, and you ought to listen to what I said, not try to put words in my mouth.
Q No, I'm not.
MR. McCLELLAN: And I think you can go back -- if you've got a specific instance of a leak, bring it up.
Q Did he have a specific instance when he said his displeasure about leaks?
MR. McCLELLAN: Yes, he was being asked about classified information being disclosed.
Q "I constantly express my displeasure with leaks, particularly classified leaks."
MR. McCLELLAN: That was in the context of people leaking classified information. But, sure, this is a town -- I mean, this is a town where that happens a lot. And a lot of those are not helpful things to have happen. But you're asking me to make a broad statement, and I'm not going to do that.
Q Scott, what was the President's reaction to this story?
MR. McCLELLAN: I'm sorry?
Q What was the President's reaction to this story? What has he said?
MR. McCLELLAN: "This story"?
Q The story, as it's published.
MR. McCLELLAN: "The story as it's published"? Which story as it's published?
Q You sound like Donald Rumsfeld. (Laughter.)
MR. McCLELLAN: "This story" -- I'm just asking you to specify what the story is.
Q I'm talking about the filing --
MR. McCLELLAN: The filing by Mr. Fitzgerald, okay.
Q -- I'm talking about what we found out --
MR. McCLELLAN: The filing by Mr. Fitzgerald. I can't get into talking with you relating to an ongoing legal proceeding.
Q I'm not asking you to. I'm asking, did the President say anything about it?
MR. McCLELLAN: Again, I can't get into talking about an ongoing legal proceeding. That relates to an ongoing legal proceeding. I just can't do that.
Q Slightly different topic, but you, yourself, said they're linked, when the Attorney General said yesterday that the President might have authority to do wireless wiretapping --
MR. McCLELLAN: Let me come back to it. I'll come back to it.
Q Thank you.
MR. McCLELLAN: Anyone else on this subject? Kelly.
Q Is there a bit of an appearance problem for this White House when the President speaks so strongly against leaking? When the Counsel's Office orders ethics classes? And then today you're talking about effectively good leaks and bad leaks, that --Point O - Back to the question of if the information was classified or declassified when it was leaked - ten days before the public was aware that the information had been declasified and released:
MR. McCLELLAN: Well, you're trying to lump a lot of things in there, and I don't think I would do that, in terms of ethics classes. I mean, those are ongoing throughout the time period we're here in this administration. So let's not lump things together.
Q But there were some that were ordered specifically --
MR. McCLELLAN: Well, let's not lump those things together.
Q There were some that were ordered specifically --
MR. McCLELLAN: You're lumping things.
Q I'm lumping only because the timing of the last public lumping was --
Q Lumper. (Laughter.)
Q -- in the fallout of (inaudible), as you may remember, that was made public. So the President is very vocal about leaking at a time when now it appears that he sees some value in releasing some --
MR. McCLELLAN: We are a nation at war. And the leaking of classified information, particularly during a time of war, is much more harmful and much more dangerous. You bet the President is going to continue to speak out about leaking classified information. It is wrong and it can have serious consequences. And what he has said about the leaking of classified information stands. He is very firm in his belief that leaking classified information, particularly information that could be harmful to our nation's security, is a serious matter and it is dangerous, and when people do it they put our nation at risk, they put lives at risk, they put sources and methods at risk.
This is a different kind of war that we are engaged in, against a deadly and dangerous enemy, an enemy that is lethal, an enemy that is sophisticated. And that is what the President often refers to when he talks about the leaking of classified information, and how serious that is.
I'll come back to you. Go ahead, Les. Are we on a different subject? Goyal is first.
Q Related.Do you believe these people, now when they say this (re: the last sentence)?
MR. McCLELLAN: Related?
MR. McCLELLAN: Okay.
Q Kind of getting back to where we started. Is information declassified when the President says it is, or when the process is done --
MR. McCLELLAN: He can authorize the declassification of information.
Q And at that moment does it become declassified, or --
MR. McCLELLAN: He's authorized declassification. He has that authority to do that.
Q At that moment. He says, today, I want this declassified -- at that moment it's declassified?
MR. McCLELLAN: I'm not saying that he has or hasn't -- if there's any specific example -- but he has that authority, yes.
Q Immediately, immediate effect?
MR. McCLELLAN: Yes. He has that authority, yes.
Q Scott, one related.
MR. McCLELLAN: One related. You all on the front row have had multiple questions.
Q I've got one related.
Q I've got one --
MR. McCLELLAN: See, you're encouraging others to do this.
Q There's lumpers up there. (Laughter.)
MR. McCLELLAN: I'm glad to stay here all day. This is an important subject, and I'm glad to make the distinctions.
Q I want to make sure we've got our terms right, that's all. It seems to me, from what I'm hearing, in terms of the way you're explaining this, classified information is leaked; declassified information is provided.
MR. McCLELLAN: Well, declosing [sic] declassified information, like we did with the National Intelligence information, that was provided to you all. That was provided to the public through you all, through your colleagues.
Q Okay, but when Judy Miller gets it, it's being provided? Or is it being leaked, because then it's declassified?
MR. McCLELLAN: Now, see, that's something that I cannot and you cannot separate from an ongoing legal proceeding. So I can't get into responding to that specific question, because how can you separate it from the legal proceeding and the filing that Mr. Fitzgerald made. I just can't do that.
Q One more, because you --
MR. McCLELLAN: See what you encouraged?
Q Well, because this has been invited by your discussion of need to educate the American public in the throes of what you say was a lot of unfair information --
MR. McCLELLAN: To provide facts.
Q To provide facts.
MR. McCLELLAN: And Congress had those facts.
Q There have been --
MR. McCLELLAN: Way back when they made the decision to authorize the President's use of force if necessary.
Q What do you say to critics who argue that the President's decision to disclose this information, to effectively declassify it, in the context of that debate, to provide facts was, in fact -- or at least in their argument -- a political use of intelligence information?
MR. McCLELLAN: It was in the public interest that this information be provided, because there is a debate going on in the public about the use of intelligence leading up to the decision to go into Iraq. This is regarding pre-war intelligence. And there was a lot of misinformation being put out. There were accusations being leveled against the President and against this White House and this administration that intelligence was misused or manipulated.
The fact of the matter is that the intelligence was based on what is laid out in the National Intelligence Estimate, which is the collective judgment of our intelligence community. The fact is that people have looked into how the intelligence was used, and they have seen, as I pointed out, no evidence of such manipulation or misuse.